Edit: I know that Friday is meant to be Music Fridays but you guys can go one week without Music Fridays, right. Because YouTube is acting all silly and nto working for me right now. Sorry but enjoy this special Can We Talk about collab that I did with James Daniel Walsh of Stop The Hate.
Tim: Hey guys, Tim here and this Can We Talk about will be kind of like my Urban Myths of Disney blog. In that I'll be talking about certain Disney rumors that have been spread over the years that I just find silly. Today though, I will be joined by author of Stop the Hate and just all around nice guy, James Daniel Walsh. James, thanks for joining me today.
JDW: Nice to be here with one of TGWTG's most popular bloggers.
Tim: Likewsie, now our first two rumors come to us from The Little Mermaid. The first one I wish to address comes from the wedding scene. Many people have claimed that if you look at the clergyman during this scene, he is having an erection and getting off to Vanessa, Ursula's human form. I never saw that and I didn't learn of this rumor until about two years ago. Even though it does appear to be one of the rather infamous ones out there. I'd like to ask all those people who thought that to take another look because if you look closely, you can see the clergyman is rather short and it has been proven and said many times now that was his knee sticking out. Now I do not know why his knee would be sticking but I still find this rumor rather odd. James, what do you make of this?
JDW: Well, I have to admit, it does LOOK like the clergyman is sporting wood. Is he? Well, the theory I've heard is that a renegade animator drew the erection to get Disney in trouble, but I have a hard time believing Disney wouldn't have screen the movie themselves and noticed what we all noticed right away. So I tend to side with you. The clergyman is short, that's probably his knee. It is, for sure, some poor animation, and I think Disney should have removed it as it does look suggestive, but I don't think someone actually drew an erection
Tim: I will admit that is some poor animation, that scene could have used some rendering before the film's release but I'd never that rumor about a renegade animator drawing that scene to try and get Disney in trouble. That is rather interesting and it also brings me to our second rumor that comes from this film. According to some if you look on the VHS cover for this film's first release, one of the pillars resembles a penis and some people have said that this was done intentioanlly. Howver according to the people that worked on the cover for the first VHS release have stated that this was an accident and that it was a late night rush to get the job done. Now I have two theories on this. First, it was a late night rush as the antimators said and they were tired. Or they were drunk while on working on this and somebody dared that particular artist to draw that and they forgot about it the next morning.
JDW: I could buy either of those theories. It does look very phallic, and its hard to believe it was a mistake. That said, how often do people say a cloud looks like a penis, or they see a penis shape on a map. Sometimes a golden pillar is just a golden pillar. Sometimes, on the other hand, some artists are drunk and drawing boners!
Tim: Exactly and you do make a good point that people sometimes say that clouds look like silly things. Now for our next rumor we will be coming up from Under The Sea and heading to The Pridelands. In case you didn't grt my joke, our next rumor comes from The Lion King. According to some there was a sex scene in The Lion King. No no that kind of sex scene. There is this rumor floating around that if you look closely at the stars in one scene from The Lion King the stars spelled out the word, sex. Now I took a good hard look at that scene and stills of it but honestly I had a hard time making out that word. Now either it's there and I'm not seeing it or people just made that one up on the fly. Quite honestly this has to be one of the more farfetched rumors that I have heard pertaining a Disney film.
Tim: I'd also like to add that while I can almost make out an S & an E, the last supposed letter looks more like a K than an X.
JDW: Agreed. I never really bought this one. First off, who noticed this!? Who was paying that close an attention to the star pattern and said, "Wait a minute! That spells sex!!" You're right, the S and the E I can kind of see, but if that's an X at the end its misshapen. I vote no on this one. I think people were just looking for something to be offended by. This isn't like in Roger Rabbit, where Jessica Rabbit's vagina was clearly visible in the original cut. This is just people reading WAY to much into something that isn't there.
Tim: Percisely, I too feel that people were just looking for something to offend them Agian, you bring something I did not know about with the Jessica Rabbit but it doesn't suprise me that tried slip that in. Now for next and fianl rumor, we'll be stepping outside of the movies and instead focus a rumor that has long been associated with Walt Disney, himself.
Tim: It's safe to say that Walt Disney is one my idols. You need look no further than what I write about. I beleive there is nothing wrong with idolizing someone. However, you need to realize that your idol was just human and had some flaws to them because no one is perfect. As much as some of us would like to think so, Walt was not a saint but he was still good person for the most part. Even though, you should recnongize the flaws fo your idol, don't assume every negative written or said about them is true. I say this because one of the oldest rumors surrounding Walt was that he was an anri-semtitc. In simpler terms people accused Walt of being a Jew hater. Now I have read five biographies, watched three documentaries on the man and for the most part, they speak against this rumor. Saying it was just that a rumor. However on documentary, I watched titled Epic Mickey - A History of Disney, which can be found in the Your Video Reviews section of TGWTG forums suggest that it was ruse. Walt was just pertending to anti-semtitc and that does make a bit of sense. You have to remember the time when Walt really hit it big, a lot of the big names in Hollywood were anti-semetic. Perhaps Walt was using this as a ruse to help the studio. I have one last question to ask and I do apologize if I offend any readers of the Jewish faith but Why would it matter if he was or wasn't anti-semtic? In this regard, I think you need to seperate the man from the movies that he made. Just look at the movies as entertainment and don't let this rumor change your view on some of the classic antimated features that he worked on.
JDW: This rumor I'm well aware of, and in fact there is some evidence to back up the claims that Walt was a bigot. However, as you said, we need to separate the man from the work, and also keep things in their proper context. We're talking about the 1930s-1950s. If we're going to start hating on people for being racist or anti-semetic, the list will be pretty long.
John Wayne said that he was a "white supremacist." Marlon Brando said that Hollywood was "full of Jews." In many a Bob Hope movie, some black guy would be called "boy." Native Americans were portrayed as savages, Africans as head hunters, etc. Nowadays, I think we can hate on bigotry a little easier. As I said in my Stop the Hate on Mel Gibson, he should have known better and anyone who wants to avoid his movies because of the horrible things he said should feel free to do so.
I love Shakespeare, and yet I find "Merchant of Venice" to be the most anti-semetic text short of "Mein Kampf." Does that mean I won't read "Hamlet" or "A Midsummer Night's Dream"? Not at all. I just avoid what offends me.
Walt Disney didn't have an evil dwarf in "Snow White" with a hook nose, greedily stealing from the other dwarves. There are no anti-Jewish sentiments in any Disney film that I'm aware of. I say this, being a quarter Jewish myself...so what if he was a bigot!? Its sad, but it in no way influences the culture he helped build with his films.
Tim: Even if Walt was, he never let it slip into his films and again as you point out with Marlon Brando and John Wayne. That is the way people thought back then. For this rumor I just go back to what I said earlier, you need to seperate the man from the movies. Don't let this rumor taint the enjoyment of your favorite Disney movie. This rumor in no way changes my love for Dumbo. Another thing we need to keep in mind is how Walt was raised as a child because his father was a bigot and children tend to emulate what they see. So in a sense Walt was emulating on his father's lesser traits.
Tim: In the end, these are just some of the most infamous rumors that I wanted to adress and I feel we did a good job on that. James, it was a pleasure to collab with you. I truly enjoyed your insight and thoughts on all of these rumors. Again, thank you for joining me.
JDW: Any time, my friend. Keep up the good work.
Tim: Hey guys, Tim here and this Can We Talk about will be kind of like my Urban Myths of Disney blog. In that I'll be talking about certain Disney rumors that have been spread over the years that I just find silly. Today though, I will be joined by author of Stop the Hate and just all around nice guy, James Daniel Walsh. James, thanks for joining me today.
JDW: Nice to be here with one of TGWTG's most popular bloggers.
Tim: Likewsie, now our first two rumors come to us from The Little Mermaid. The first one I wish to address comes from the wedding scene. Many people have claimed that if you look at the clergyman during this scene, he is having an erection and getting off to Vanessa, Ursula's human form. I never saw that and I didn't learn of this rumor until about two years ago. Even though it does appear to be one of the rather infamous ones out there. I'd like to ask all those people who thought that to take another look because if you look closely, you can see the clergyman is rather short and it has been proven and said many times now that was his knee sticking out. Now I do not know why his knee would be sticking but I still find this rumor rather odd. James, what do you make of this?
JDW: Well, I have to admit, it does LOOK like the clergyman is sporting wood. Is he? Well, the theory I've heard is that a renegade animator drew the erection to get Disney in trouble, but I have a hard time believing Disney wouldn't have screen the movie themselves and noticed what we all noticed right away. So I tend to side with you. The clergyman is short, that's probably his knee. It is, for sure, some poor animation, and I think Disney should have removed it as it does look suggestive, but I don't think someone actually drew an erection
Tim: I will admit that is some poor animation, that scene could have used some rendering before the film's release but I'd never that rumor about a renegade animator drawing that scene to try and get Disney in trouble. That is rather interesting and it also brings me to our second rumor that comes from this film. According to some if you look on the VHS cover for this film's first release, one of the pillars resembles a penis and some people have said that this was done intentioanlly. Howver according to the people that worked on the cover for the first VHS release have stated that this was an accident and that it was a late night rush to get the job done. Now I have two theories on this. First, it was a late night rush as the antimators said and they were tired. Or they were drunk while on working on this and somebody dared that particular artist to draw that and they forgot about it the next morning.
JDW: I could buy either of those theories. It does look very phallic, and its hard to believe it was a mistake. That said, how often do people say a cloud looks like a penis, or they see a penis shape on a map. Sometimes a golden pillar is just a golden pillar. Sometimes, on the other hand, some artists are drunk and drawing boners!
Tim: Exactly and you do make a good point that people sometimes say that clouds look like silly things. Now for our next rumor we will be coming up from Under The Sea and heading to The Pridelands. In case you didn't grt my joke, our next rumor comes from The Lion King. According to some there was a sex scene in The Lion King. No no that kind of sex scene. There is this rumor floating around that if you look closely at the stars in one scene from The Lion King the stars spelled out the word, sex. Now I took a good hard look at that scene and stills of it but honestly I had a hard time making out that word. Now either it's there and I'm not seeing it or people just made that one up on the fly. Quite honestly this has to be one of the more farfetched rumors that I have heard pertaining a Disney film.
Tim: I'd also like to add that while I can almost make out an S & an E, the last supposed letter looks more like a K than an X.
JDW: Agreed. I never really bought this one. First off, who noticed this!? Who was paying that close an attention to the star pattern and said, "Wait a minute! That spells sex!!" You're right, the S and the E I can kind of see, but if that's an X at the end its misshapen. I vote no on this one. I think people were just looking for something to be offended by. This isn't like in Roger Rabbit, where Jessica Rabbit's vagina was clearly visible in the original cut. This is just people reading WAY to much into something that isn't there.
Tim: Percisely, I too feel that people were just looking for something to offend them Agian, you bring something I did not know about with the Jessica Rabbit but it doesn't suprise me that tried slip that in. Now for next and fianl rumor, we'll be stepping outside of the movies and instead focus a rumor that has long been associated with Walt Disney, himself.
Tim: It's safe to say that Walt Disney is one my idols. You need look no further than what I write about. I beleive there is nothing wrong with idolizing someone. However, you need to realize that your idol was just human and had some flaws to them because no one is perfect. As much as some of us would like to think so, Walt was not a saint but he was still good person for the most part. Even though, you should recnongize the flaws fo your idol, don't assume every negative written or said about them is true. I say this because one of the oldest rumors surrounding Walt was that he was an anri-semtitc. In simpler terms people accused Walt of being a Jew hater. Now I have read five biographies, watched three documentaries on the man and for the most part, they speak against this rumor. Saying it was just that a rumor. However on documentary, I watched titled Epic Mickey - A History of Disney, which can be found in the Your Video Reviews section of TGWTG forums suggest that it was ruse. Walt was just pertending to anti-semtitc and that does make a bit of sense. You have to remember the time when Walt really hit it big, a lot of the big names in Hollywood were anti-semetic. Perhaps Walt was using this as a ruse to help the studio. I have one last question to ask and I do apologize if I offend any readers of the Jewish faith but Why would it matter if he was or wasn't anti-semtic? In this regard, I think you need to seperate the man from the movies that he made. Just look at the movies as entertainment and don't let this rumor change your view on some of the classic antimated features that he worked on.
JDW: This rumor I'm well aware of, and in fact there is some evidence to back up the claims that Walt was a bigot. However, as you said, we need to separate the man from the work, and also keep things in their proper context. We're talking about the 1930s-1950s. If we're going to start hating on people for being racist or anti-semetic, the list will be pretty long.
John Wayne said that he was a "white supremacist." Marlon Brando said that Hollywood was "full of Jews." In many a Bob Hope movie, some black guy would be called "boy." Native Americans were portrayed as savages, Africans as head hunters, etc. Nowadays, I think we can hate on bigotry a little easier. As I said in my Stop the Hate on Mel Gibson, he should have known better and anyone who wants to avoid his movies because of the horrible things he said should feel free to do so.
I love Shakespeare, and yet I find "Merchant of Venice" to be the most anti-semetic text short of "Mein Kampf." Does that mean I won't read "Hamlet" or "A Midsummer Night's Dream"? Not at all. I just avoid what offends me.
Walt Disney didn't have an evil dwarf in "Snow White" with a hook nose, greedily stealing from the other dwarves. There are no anti-Jewish sentiments in any Disney film that I'm aware of. I say this, being a quarter Jewish myself...so what if he was a bigot!? Its sad, but it in no way influences the culture he helped build with his films.
Tim: Even if Walt was, he never let it slip into his films and again as you point out with Marlon Brando and John Wayne. That is the way people thought back then. For this rumor I just go back to what I said earlier, you need to seperate the man from the movies. Don't let this rumor taint the enjoyment of your favorite Disney movie. This rumor in no way changes my love for Dumbo. Another thing we need to keep in mind is how Walt was raised as a child because his father was a bigot and children tend to emulate what they see. So in a sense Walt was emulating on his father's lesser traits.
Tim: In the end, these are just some of the most infamous rumors that I wanted to adress and I feel we did a good job on that. James, it was a pleasure to collab with you. I truly enjoyed your insight and thoughts on all of these rumors. Again, thank you for joining me.
JDW: Any time, my friend. Keep up the good work.
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